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Updating a unified MPE library to work with Linnstrument

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getdunne
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User @sj1 writes:

Hi.    

I'm using a Linnstrument and the 'Arturia Pigments 3.5 MPE Enabled.guru' is currently MPE incompatible because the setting of the Pigments patches for Pitch Bend Range is 48 semitones whereas the maximum setting on the Linnstrument is +/- 24 semitones.  Upon reading, this may seem correctly matched, but it is not.

In general, there seems to be some confusion in the industry around PB Range labeling, and sometimes what works correctly is when the sender and the receiver are seemingly "off by a factor of 2".

In this case, however, my Linnstrument (actual testing here) is maxed out at +/- 24, when driving this Unify library the PB results are not correct and the only changes available on the Linnstrument (downward to +/- 12, etc.) make the situation even worse.

So, the only adjustment that will fix this situation is on the patches side, to reduce the setting from PB Range setting in Pigments from 48 semitones to 24 semitones.   I have confirmed this in fact (using a single patch).   Obviously, hand-editing 1350 patches is not-to-be-desired.

Is there a bulk editing capability that would allow the library to be re-made with this corrected setting?

I would *really* love to have all those Pigments patches in Unify, MPE correct (for the Linnstrument) and ready-to-go!


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getdunne
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@sj1

I'm not familiar with the Linnstrument, but from what you have written, it sounds as though it has its own internal synth, which can only bend max 2 octaves up or down, and you'd like a version of the unified Arturia Pigments 3.5 MPE Enabled library where Pigments is also set to that bend range, instead of the MPE-standard range of +/- 4 octaves, so Pigments and the Linnstrument will bend in sync.

That's not a simple change, but I'll look into it and see if there might be a way to automate it.


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sj1
 sj1
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Hi @getdunne.   Thanks for your reply!

To clarify, the Linnstrument is an MPE capable controller, not a synth.

Indeed, it is one of the major, known, "standard" MPE controllers. 

Roger Linn has seen to it that the MPE implementation is superb, and so the Linnstrument is, in many ways, a key "reference controller" in the world of MPE.

The issue is that one wants a "slide" of say, two keys (pads), to create a PB of 2 semitones.   In general, most people don't want to have a slide of a single key (pad) create a 2 semitones bend.   (Some might want that, some of the time ...)

So, Linnstrument is sending, Pigments is receiving.   Problem is that Pigments is bending "too much", and to fix that, the Pigments setting needs to be '24 semitones'  (as per Pigments terminology) instead of '48 semitones'.

Thank you for checking out the possibility of automating the creation of a new library.  If there is anything I can do directly to explain or assist, I'd be happy to.   Just PM or email me.

Cheers!


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getdunne
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@sj1

There's something I'm missing here. MIDI pitch-bend messages are simply arbitrary 14-bit numbers. It's up to each synth/instrument to determine what those pitch-bend numbers mean in terms of semitones. If the Linnstrument is indeed a pure MIDI controller, it's surprising to me that it would provide a way to set pitch-bend range in semitones.

Whatever the explanation, if Pigments bends 48 semitones when the gesture you make on the Linnstrument is supposed to result in only 24 semitones, you definitely do have an issue. I've done a few experiments, and I agree, you would need the entire unified library (1350 patches!) to be rebuilt with Pigments reset to 24-semitone range.

@zinct I think you made the unified Pigments libraries. I'm pretty sure AutoHotKey could be used to update all the patches, but that script would tie up the PC for some time. I don't suppose you'd care to try that?


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sj1
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@getdunne  Attached is a picture with some info re: Linnstrument Bend Range settings.

It's an amount-of-physical-space  to  amount-of-PB  thing, where the amount of physical space is expressed in columns (pads), and one pad is one semitone as far as notes are concerned outside the question of pitch bending.

It seems to me that we are on the same page here.

P.S.  Is it in fact possible to post a link here?   All my tries so far have lead to no more than a mess!

 

 


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getdunne
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@sj1

Thanks for the manual reference. I've just contacted Roger Linn to seek his advice.


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sj1
 sj1
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@getdunne I'm sure Roger will do his best to answer any question you have, but you nailed it here, IMO:

Whatever the explanation, if Pigments bends 48 semitones when the gesture you make on the Linnstrument is supposed to result in only 24 semitones, you definitely do have an issue. I've done a few experiments, and I agree, you would need the entire unified library (1350 patches!) to be rebuilt with Pigments reset to 24-semitone range.


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getdunne
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@sj1

I'm just curious why you can't seem to set up the Linnstrument's pitch-bend range to correspond with the standard MPE range. Let's see what Roger says.


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getdunne
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@sj1 Here's Roger Linn's response:

Thanks for your question. LinnStrument can be set to any bend range from 1 to 96 semitones. To do this:

In Per-Split Settings, Bend Range column, HOLD the “+/-24” button. You’ll see a large number 24. Swype left or right to change it to any value from 1 to 96. 

There’s also a shortcut. In the MIDI Mode column, HOLD the ChPerNote button. This will change all other MIDI settings to the MPE defaults, including Bend Range of 48. 

This information and more can be found on the Panel Settings page, Per-Split Settings tab, Bend Range section. The above short-cut is also mentioned on the Getting Started page. 

If you have any other questions, it’s my pleasure to help. 


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sj1
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Ah, nice, certainly good to know, even if it is a deeper dive than the +/- 2, 3, 12, and 24 settings which are "one-touch" on the Linnstrument "Per-split Settings" page.

I question though the assumption that "48 semitones", as might be chosen in Pigments, is the "MPE standard"

I've been doing MPE for a few years now, have the Linnstrument and other controllers, have a fistful of MPE soft-synths, and NEVER until now have I had to set the Linnstrument above +/- 24   (never that is, until encountering the Unify Library for Pigments).

Raising the Linnstrument setting above +/- 24 is going to make it (while set that way) incompatible with every other soft-synth I use.   This seems kind of contrary to the idea of Unify, which is to be able to (hopefully seamlessly) use all the plugins together at once.

What I'm saying is, it seems to me based on experience that "48 semitones" for Pigments, rather than being "standard" is actually an outlier setting.  I predict that distributing the library that way (only) is going to hand off the incompatibility as per above to every user of Unify/Pigments/AnyThingElse at once.

For this reason, I still suggest that a Unify Library for Pigments set to "24 semitones" would be a very useful thing to have, and probably the most desired setup for more people than not.

Too bad a change from "48 semitones" to "24 semitones" requires 1350 operations instead of just one!

Even so though, perhaps at some point that alternative library could be constructed ( maybe on an automated overnight run ).

Further discussion might be in order, because if all Unify libraries for MPE instrument are going to be distributed with some "standard" PB range setting, then having that setting be most easily and quickly accessible from hopefully all controllers is desirable. 

Alternatively, if there is no standard chosen, then it will not be possible to immediately load different MPE instruments from different Unify libraries and have them "just work" together wrt. MPE PB.

This post was modified 2 months ago by sj1

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getdunne
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@sj1

From the official standard (MIDI Polyphonic Expression, Version 1.0, March-12-2018, Published By: The MIDI Manufacturers Association, Los Angeles, CA), section 1.2 (emphasis added):

Pitch Bend is, by default, set to a range of ±48 semitones for per-note bend and ±2 semitones for Master bend. Either range may be changed to a number of semitones between 0 and ±96 using RPN 0.


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sj1
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@getdunne

Your citations are impeccable. I consider myself reminded / remedially schooled! Thank you for your engagement on this topic.

I now see that what happened with me as a LinnStrument user was that I pivoted everything in my setup off of this (from the LinnStrument Panel Settings page):

"A value of 24 is ideal for LinnStrument because it permits pitch slides of up to 2 octaves, which is the length of each row in the large LinnStrument model."

So while a value of +/- 24 may indeed be excellent for the LinnStrument (it's worked great for me so far!), as you make clear (and indeed Roger has as well in his docs), it's not the default MIDI MPE standard!

I concede now that it is LinnStrument users like myself following the quote above who are the outliers. Thus, I can no longer advocate that Unify libraries should coalesce around +/- 24 as a standard.

All I can now say is that alternative Unify libraries set to +/- 24 would be a nice-to-have for the specific subset of folks who have LinnStruments and agree with the quote above.

Which pretty much makes it up to us to produce them, if we can, and if the effort is worth it!

Sorry for not realizing all this on my own to begin with. Thank you for helping me get here.

Best Regards!


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