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Most Unify patches have reversed filter cutoff filter parameters

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Lowell
(@lowell)
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Joined: 4 years ago
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I'm curious... a number of recent patches have Macro 1 (usually CC14, filter cutoff) set up with a reversed path. That is, instead of increasing the parameter to increase the filter frequency, as most patches have been setup in the past, they're often now set up so when you increase the parameter value the filter frequency decreases.

This causes a lot of re-work in changing and then re-saving the patch to the User library so it's consistent with how other synths work, and how I've typically set up that macro knob (map CC14 to a synth's filter cutoff and lower values mean lower frequencies automatically). No longer can you just insert another Unify patch and have CC14/Macro1/Filter cutoff behave consistently and change your overall sound as you'd expect. Some sounds get their frequency cut while others are getting theirs opened up.

Is this a permanent change, on purpose?

[EDIT: OK, maybe all of the Unify patches are set up this way. I am still curious as to why. If I map a controller to the filter cutoff knob in say, Kontakt's filter, decreasing the value on the knob decreases the filter value, not the other way around. It seems that most synths and their filters are set up this way. Why are Unify patches set up the opposite way?]


   
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pluginguru
(@pluginguruforums)
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Hello Lowell - My philosophy is simple - Bright sounds, the mod wheel will darken them. Dark Sounds the filter will brighten them. I dislike when you move the mod wheel and the sound JUMPS to a totally different sound than intended, instead I have always preferred a natural change from a Mod Wheel value of 0. Many keyboard controllers spring back to 0, and don't stay like the Mod Wheel on other instruments so I always program assuming that the mod wheel is starting at 0.

Life is Sound / Sound is Divine
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Lowell
(@lowell)
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Joined: 4 years ago
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Hi, John! Thanks for answering. I'm mostly wondering about Macro knob 1, which is usually mapped to CC14. The mod wheel is usually CC1, so whatever it does is fine, and that's cool.

But for CC14, for example in a lot of pad patches, it's often mapped as a filter cutoff control. Inside of a synth (i.e., Kontakt or similar), when a filter cutoff knob is turned all the way counter-clockwise, that typically means it's filtering out almost (or all) of the frequencies. It's at the lowest value. Then when you turn the knob clockwise it gradually increases the filter frequency and allows brighter sounds.

This is opposite in many or most Unify patches. Turning the knob counter-clockwise, you're increasing the filter frequency and it's brightening the sound. I'm curious as to why it's backwards from other synths.

I've gotten used to just mapping CC14 on my Kontakt keyboard, to filter cutoff for any synth I'm using. And to do that, like in Kontakt, I just right-click on the FC knob to learn CC14, turn the knob on my keyboard, and it's mapped. Counter-clockwise to reduce the filter frequency. But if I layer a Unified pad patch, it's opposite. So now I have to go into the Unify patch, reverse the CC14 mapping so lower values mean lower values in frequency cutoff, then save the patch into my user library and identify it somehow so I remember to use that one, not the original, in the future.

Does that make sense?


   
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(@getdunne)
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Joined: 5 years ago
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@lowell

The Macro/CC mapping is not fixed; it's basically a user preference. Unify remembers however you set it up for your specific controller.

The closest thing we have to a standard is the "Unify Default" preset, which maps the first eight macro knobs to CC's 1, 2, 4, 67, 84, 85, 86, and 87, respectively. This is based on the 4-macro map that Laurent Veronnez (AIRWAVE) defined for his Omnisphere libraries, which John later adopted and extended.

John tends to define patches with Macro 1 not linked to anything, on the assumption that the Macro 1 knob is mapped to CC#1 (mod wheel). Because many plug-ins including Omnisphere and even Guru Sampler allow to be mapped directly, and this is feature often used in presets for those plug-ins, including presets used in Unify patches, John's idea is that he doesn't want CC#1 to also do things the user might not expect.

Because you have a NI Komplete Kontrol keyboard, it will be most natural for you to map Unify's macro knobs to CC#14, CC#15, etc., corresponding to the main group of knobs above the faders. This is exactly how I intended the saved CC/macro mapping feature to be used, BUT as you have discovered, the results may not quite match what the patch designer intended.

I'm not sure if this issue even has a generic solution. Ideas are welcome.


   
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pluginguru
(@pluginguruforums)
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@lowell - It makes sense but as Shane mentioned, I think of Macro knob 1 as the Mod wheel and defined it that way so that the Patches do something interesting with the Mod wheel. Your "Layout" breaks this because you've pointed what I define as the mod wheel which starts ALWAYS at a value of 0 and then increases to a knob where it would typically be the opposite. Maybe in the future GuruSampler will have a MIDI CC "Skin" where each knob can be assigned a MIDI CC# but that is not happening anytime soon... 

 

So you're welcome to keep MacroKnob 1 assigned to your filter knob but please be aware that is not how knob 1 is intended to be mapped. It does do pitch LFO on retro patches and on some basses etc. It does reverb sweeps on drums where it brings up reverb and other parameters. It basically does something interesting and useful based on the context of the sound. It's not JUST ever going to be assigned to do filter...

Life is Sound / Sound is Divine
www.pluginguru.com


   
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Lowell
(@lowell)
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Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 109
Topic starter  

@pluginguruforums Thanks for explaining. I think I didn't realize that when I assigned Macro 1 knob to CC14 it did that across the board, that it's not a per-patch assignment (which is a good thing).

And yeah, I'm just focusing on the patches to which Macro 1 knob is assigned to filter cutoff. I'll have to play around with it a bit more and see if I can figure out something that works best. 


   
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