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More Macro knobs?

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(@hexabuzz)
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@getdunne

Shane, I've been using the Macro knobs for mix level controls in multi layered patches, but I'm often forced to choose between live volume control of layers and controlling other parameters - Is there any way of getting more Macro knobs, or an alternative to controlling a layer's mix level other than with a macro?


   
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(@getdunne)
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@hexabuzz

I've been working on ideas for this. Do you want to control layer levels using MIDI only, or do you need to automate in a DAW?


   
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karlfranz
(@karlfranz)
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Not only would I like to see 16 macro knobs by default, I think it would be great if Unify allowed the ability to switch between different banks of 16 macro knobs via key switches, MIDI CC#, keyboard shortcut keys or other methods. Ideally, macro assignments could be duplicated across banks so certain macros could be available regardless of which bank you currently have selected.

Also, sending MIDI feedback out of Unify would be nice so that LED rings around encoders would update to match the actual values.

 

And, yes, DAW automation please.


   
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karlfranz
(@karlfranz)
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As I mentioned several months ago in another thread, it would also be cool if the macro controls, MIDI Keyboard, Transport Controls, and even the Patch Browser windows could be undocked/re-docked from the main Unify window.

Finally, is there a need to have each copy of Unify embedded as a layer to have its own Macro, MIDI Keyboard and Transport windows? Or should one copy of these windows be shared across all instances?


   
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(@getdunne)
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@karlfranz

Very interesting suggestion about switching between banks of macros -- I will look into that. The new copy/paste features coming in Unify v1.2 will simplify duplication of functionality.

Which MIDI controllers do you know of that have "LED rings around encoders"? I'd like to learn more about that.

DAW automation is possible already; all 8 Macro parameters are exposed to the DAW.

Your ideas about window structures are interesting, but will entail a great deal of work. It will be some time before I can address them.


   
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karlfranz
(@karlfranz)
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MIDI controllers with LED rings around encoders that I own include the MIDI Fighter Twister, Behringer X-Touch mini, Akai APC40 mkII. Many others feature them as well, but of all of them, the MIDI Fighter is my favorite. It has excellent built quality.


   
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(@hexabuzz)
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@getdunne

Shane,

I wasn't really thinking about DAW automation, but that would be great! I was just thinking more from a sound design/performance standpoint inside Unify.

Now, though, I've been thinking about it even more, and wouldn't it be amazing if...

Picture a MIDI control surface like a Launch Control XL, or similar.

Now build a multi-layered Unify patch and inside of each instrument layer, have macro knobs assigned to performance controls on each individual instrument, and layer effect.

Then, have knobs assigned to global parameters for the overall patch (including effects, etc) and the sliders assigned to levels, and switches assigned to channel mute/solo, or any other interesting on/off parameter you could imagine.

This would be an absolute beast of a sound design/performance setup, and if it all could be captured in a DAW, it would be even more amazing.

I know I'm asking a lot, but this would be beyond a game changer for me.

[img] [/img]


   
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ChrisG UK
(@chrisg-uk)
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Hi,

 

the Nocturn has led feedback on eight rotaries. 

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/novation-nocturn-25

 

Chris G
Hardware: ROLI Seaboard, ROLI Lightpad, LinnStrument, Native Instruments S61, CC121
Software: Cubase 12 pro, Native Instruments, Equator 2, Cypher2, Strobe2
OS: MacBook Pro 2019, Big Sur 11.7, iPad Pro


   
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(@getdunne)
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@hexabuzz

We are certainly headed in that direction, so stay tuned.

 


   
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(@hexabuzz)
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@getdunne

That's awesome! 

I'm sure you'll get a chuckle out of the fact that when Unify was first announced, I was one of the people who said "Why would I ever want or need something like that?", and decided to just take a chance on getting it to make sure I wasn't missing something - Well, I figured out really quickly how great and useful it was, and I'm so thankful that you and John have turned it into such an amazing tool. Even if nothing else were ever added or changed, it would be one of my most favorite and essential creation tools, and knowing that it's only going to get better is really like a dream.

Thank you for being so interested in what we as end users are looking for, and also for being so responsive to implementing changes, fixes, and new features. It really is appreciated.


   
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(@bramvdm)
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@getdunne

For me also the midi fighter twister is a very powerfull midi controller with LED indications rings. It would be absolute fantastic if we would have a bidirectional connection that midi info was feed back to the midi controllers.

With the change of the patches this would give the correct (updated) status to the knobs for every patch. An absolute game changer...

Do you have already plans for this?


   
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Nico5
(@nico5)
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Which MIDI controllers do you know of that have "LED rings around encoders"? I'd like to learn more about that.

For a more complete midi controller experience to for development and testing, you may want to consider developing with a midi controller that has bi-directional midi with

  • endless rotary knobs that also display their current setting in some way (LED rings or separate display)
  • push buttons that can toggle or trigger and also display their display their current status in some way
  • pads that send and receive midi note numbers, ideally also with polyphonic aftertouch/pressure (pads receiving midi notes would light up the corresponding pad) - and even better, if one can assign

I picked up a used Maschine Mk2 controller some time ago, which can do all 3 of the above and it can be configured really nicely with the NI Controller Editor software. That controller displays the current position of the knobs on a separate display, rather than an LED ring. While it has "only" 8 knobs and 8 buttons, these represent banks of 8 that can be switched via buttons on the hardware (much like a transpose on a keyboard). I've made templates with 64 knobs and 64 buttons distributed over 8 banks.

Since the Mk2 aren't latest generation, they frequently show up used for a pretty low price. Local used prices for that one in the greater Vancouver area have been between CAD 150 and CAD 300.  Side note: Out here in the Vancouver area, FaceBook marketplace has been an emerging place for decent used musical gear.

I'm not necessarily shilling for the Maschine, but out of the over 10 controllers I currently have, it's probably the most feature rich and flexible for the price I paid.

 

Also in Unify: It would be great to be able to (optionally) see all 32 currently available Macro knobs without having to click on the user interface.

 

 

Cubase 13 Pro, Win 10 Pro (x64), several different midi controllers


   
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(@getdunne)
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Posted by: @nico

For a more complete midi controller experience to for development and testing, you may want to consider developing with a midi controller that has bi-directional midi with

  • endless rotary knobs that also display their current setting in some way (LED rings or separate display)
  • push buttons that can toggle or trigger and also display their display their current status in some way
  • pads that send and receive midi note numbers, ideally also with polyphonic aftertouch/pressure (pads receiving midi notes would light up the corresponding pad) - and even better, if one can assign

No controller with the features you list has remained in production for long, and while they are available, they're expensive. Maschine Mk3 is available here (to order, local store out of stock of course), but at CAD$819 apiece.

However, a good friend of mine has a Maschine controller and may be able to help with development. I will discuss with him.


   
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(@ssquared)
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If by bi-directional it means making a change on one thing will change on the other, then there are some apps that offer similar functionality.  I used "TB MIDI Stuff" on my iPad for several years.  I wrote editors for my hardware synths.  When making a change on the hardware, it would immediately show up in the app as well.  Switching patches caused the entire screen to update with all the latest values.  It was really nice, but never became a popular choice for some reason.  It has rotary knobs, sliders, switches, X/Y, a bunch of controls.  It was also one of the very few of these types of apps that included the ability to use SysEx which was a major feature in my book.  Looks like TB MIDI Stuff is still around.

Maybe Lemur can do it, but I never got far enough with Lemur before I moved off of my iPad.  Lemur is also abandoned.  I demoed MIDI Designer Pro but it didn't match what I got with MIDI Stuff.  There are several other apps I have or tried, but I can't remember their names.  Also, I left the iPad six years ago, so my memory is distant and knowledge on the latest is lacking.

A few options if you have an iPad rather than having to purchase hardware.

Ableton Live 10, Omnisphere, Native Instruments (Pianos), Spire, Hammer + Waves, Heavyocity (Ascend and Mosaic Keys), Diva, SynthMaster, Alchemy 1.55, Addictive Keys, Unify


   
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(@getdunne)
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@ssquared

As far as I can tell, TouchOSC is the appropriate replacement for Lemur. They have recently completely rebuilt their mobile app and it looks to be greatly improved. They also addressed the biggest weakness of the old one, which was over-complexity in how templates were edited and loaded.


   
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(@ssquared)
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Wow!  Thanks @getdunne for the pointer.  I've looked at TouchOSC over the years and it does look like they have really improved things.  I don't use my iPad anymore, but I am especially interested in a Windows option (I have a touchscreen) which TouchOSC has.

Ableton Live 10, Omnisphere, Native Instruments (Pianos), Spire, Hammer + Waves, Heavyocity (Ascend and Mosaic Keys), Diva, SynthMaster, Alchemy 1.55, Addictive Keys, Unify


   
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Daren
(@daren)
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@getdunne @SSquared   Just FYI - I was using the TouchOSC Mk1 (older version) but then it started to disconnect both MIDI keyboards from the computer. Now, it freezes up Logic Pro, Unify and Kontakt (Native Instruments).   I was hoping the new TouchOSC version would work much better but the manual and UX/UI design, in my opinion, is even worse than the previous version.  People are complaining on their FB Template Makers group for lack of product support for their latest release.  🤨 


   
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(@ssquared)
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@daren  Bummer.  From the description on the website it sounded like some good changes.  It's been so long, but i seem to recall those were similar reasons I didn't use TouchOSC.  TB MIDI Stuff, man it had bugs, but I understood how to use it and was doing some fun stuff with it.  The developer was also responsive in helping with technical questions.  I know it's an odd name and the website isn't high quality, but the app is super powerful.  

Ableton Live 10, Omnisphere, Native Instruments (Pianos), Spire, Hammer + Waves, Heavyocity (Ascend and Mosaic Keys), Diva, SynthMaster, Alchemy 1.55, Addictive Keys, Unify


   
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Daren
(@daren)
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@ssquared  It was actually great when it worked.   I think the OSC (Open Sound Control) isn't there yet.  So many OSC Apps on the AppStore tout they're the one to use but end up 'bricking' aka not working and therefore abandoned.  


   
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