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Multiple Outs


RainBro
(@rainbro)
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I'd like to see multiple outs one day in order to refine the output of certain layers by (i.e.) FX with sidechain functionality or in general to have more DAW control when complex patches are at work.

While Unify is a perfect tool to stack sounds to form a unique(!) layered sound it is also a great tool for sketching ideas (see the BPM SPLIT patches) that'd profit from dismantling the individual parts in later production stages.


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getdunne
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We hear you @RainBro! Multiple audio outputs is high on our to-do list, as is more flexible routing options (for sidechaining, etc.). The list is very long, though, and we have some pressing tech-support issues to tackle first, so patience is appreciated.

Keep this great feedback coming. We want to hear what's on your "must have" and "wish" lists!

 


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WatchTheGuitar
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As I've started to use Unify more recently this has become the number one thing that stops me using it for everything because while I love to get lost in the additive layering workflow it makes it impossible to post-process the individual layers after recording in Reaper etc.

It really takes me out of it if I have to load up separate unify instances to achieve this.

Is multichannel audio output still on the list for future development?


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getdunne
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Posted by: @watchtheguitar

Is multichannel audio output still on the list for future development?

Yes, still on the list.

In the meantime, note you can render individual layers to audio, by soloing one layer at a time, then put those on multiple DAW tracks and process to your heart's content. Yes, it's extra work, but you don't need multiple Unify instances, and CPU usage will plummet as you won't be running all the synths.


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nonchai
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@getdunne

Can I second this plea for multiple outputs - I think in particular its going to be essential for serious BBC SO users of your CoreStation product - because any pro composer is going to want to mix instruments seperately. 

But in addition can I also press you to add additional multiple MIDI inputs and outputs - in order when -  for example having a patch for a string section - such that the notes being produced internally via some MIDI file pattern etc - get output from the plugin and can be routed to separate tracks. 

This is in order that composers can work on all the actual MIDI note information that is being sent to the BBC SO plugins ( or Vienna ensemble pro for that matter ) and not just on the sparse keyboard input information. 

For example one might be playing a held-chord and UNIFY puts out arpeggios and motifs to five different BBC SO instruments ( using DIVISIMATE style principles one hopes )  and the held down chords get recorded into the DAW. But... once this is done one enters a second stage where one can actually edit the actual MIDI for each instrument. 

 

For this to work UNIFY+CORESTATION  would have two modes of operation - one where it responds as currently to keyboard input - on a single MIDI channel - MIDI channel 1  - just held chords or single note entry for example... but then the other mode would be where the plugin receives and responds to a different stream of MIDI data - for example on 5 different channels - 2 to 6 - containing separate MIDI data for each of the  5 sections in the orchestra. 

 

This would allow  UNIFY to be used in exploratory ideas mode - but then work within the DAW in fine MIDI detail - to make fine grained changes to MANY MIDI note that was initially generated by UNIFY - that now resides in a recorded MIDI track in the DAW.

 

So in our example here of a patch that in UNIFY just has 5 instances of BBC SO - there would be - in the DAW - SIX MIDI tracks set up - one for UNIFY and operating as things do now... but the other five midi tracks - for Violins 1, Violins 2, Violas, Cellos and basses. 

 

 


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nonchai
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I've also sent you a PM - as I've worked in the past on a JUCE VST hosting idea similar ( but also different ) to the client-server stuff you discussed in the talk you gave at the ADC - on "networking for audio plugins". 

I sadly placed this project on back burner ( aka shelved it ) as my intended market seemed ideally suited to Vienna Ensemble Pro.  But my idea ( and JUCE code ) worked in quite a different way to how typical media/film composers work with huge templates and VEP on the back end - so recently have been wondering if its worth resurrecting my idea. 

 

I'd like to discuss this and possible future collaboration on JUCE etc via email and zoom/FaceTime etc  some time.

 

(I'm based in the UK so there'll be a time difference ()


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getdunne
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@nonchai

Lots of interesting ideas here; thank you. I will get in touch directly to discuss.

Note very few DAWs support multiple MIDI outputs from plug-ins. Most only barely support one.


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nonchai
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@getdunne Agreed.  Actually just sending all the midi for all MIDI CHANNELS to a single track in the DAW would be a start - and with Cubase for example it has a nifty "convert to lanes" where all the notes for a specific midi channel get put in seperate lanes. 

This  is currently being used by composers using OPUS ORCHESTRATOR and  Cubase so they can record the actual MIDI being produced for every orchestral instrument onto a separator track from the control track. Its then a simple move from there to use the "separate into lanes" MIDI feature in Cubase to allow the MIDI for each instrument part to be viewed and edited separately.

 


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getdunne
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Posted by: @nonchai

...just sending all the midi for all MIDI CHANNELS to a single track in the DAW would be a start - and with Cubase for example it has a nifty "convert to lanes" where all the notes for a specific midi channel get put in separate lanes. 

Interesting idea, added to the to-do list (at the bottom of page 44).

This is an example of a useful feature which could conceivably be added to Unify, but in practice would probably be more work than it's worth, not just to design and implement, but more importantly to support for the indefinite future.

My hope is that some future version of Unify will add some kind of user programmability, so people can create such things themselves as add-ons, and with luck, a community of skilled programmers may emerge to handle this on an open-source basis.


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nonchai
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Posted by: @getdunne
Posted by: @nonchai

...just sending all the midi for all MIDI CHANNELS to a single track in the DAW would be a start - and with Cubase for example it has a nifty "convert to lanes" where all the notes for a specific midi channel get put in separate lanes. 

Interesting idea, added to the to-do list (at the bottom of page 44).

This is an example of a useful feature which could conceivably be added to Unify, but in practice would probably be more work than it's worth, 

If by this you mean  adding the functionality above  concerning conversion to lanes into UNIFY - no I wasn't intending that. 

 

All I ( and lots of others I suspect who are using or interested in the BBC SO Discovery pack ) really need is to be able to 

 

a )  [ simplest to implement ? ]  just be able to export actual MIDI being played by any instrument inside UNIFY ( eg midi send to all instances of BBC SO plugin )  as a single midi file where every instrument has its  own midi channel ( as per the formal MIDI file specs) 

 

b ) ability  to route MIDI data ( for up to 16 MIDI channels ) out of the UNITY plugin in real-time to a MIDI track in the DAW. 

 

I'd be happy to help coding wise. 

 

this might be only a "nice to have" for users of the regular UNIFY synth type packs - but it seriously limits what's possible composer-wise with the DISCOVERY version. 

 

Hence why Opus Orchestrator has this. The opus engine just sends everything out on a single MIDI output. No more. Hence why there are videos being made  like this.: 

 

"EW Opus Orchestrator midi export to Cubase"

https://youtu.be/0rkrmU4b4rg  

and this: 

"EW Opus Orchestrator routing individual midi Channels to new instruments in Cubase ( better solution ) "

https://youtu.be/WWg0poqOmEg  

 

 


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nonchai
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slightly off topic but related - I actually recently pondered selling my BBC SO Pro license in order to buy EW Opus Hollywood Orchestra / Orchestrator because it seemed so much like what I really need - but ...

 

... ALAS!  Spitfire forbids selling on one's Spitfire licenses - so unlike NI and Komplete etc....  I'm stuck with it 🙁

 

Still - BBC SO sounds superb - and- having evaluated OPUS for a few days now by means of the monthly subscription - its clear that EWs OPUS engine needs a lot of refinement. Lots of clicks etc- and takes up tons of CPU needlessly.  

 

All the more reason why I'd so love to see MIDI output in UNIFY !

🙂


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